By sarod77 |

Maria was to marry Jose Serapia Escalante vuido de Juana Juliana Monsebais but she passed before the six month penance was given for primer grado. I couldn't read exactly how it was primer grado but it sounded as if she had had an illicit relationship before not sure with whom. Thanks for the help

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-15239-47745-59?cc=1804458 : accessed 17 October 2015), Pinos > San Matías > Información matrimonial 1799 > image 10 of 608; paróquias Católicas, Zacatecas (Catholic Church parishes, Zacatecas).

victorianonavarro (not verified)

9 years 9 months ago

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It does't say with whom, but since it is a primer grado, my guess is that they were having an illicit relationship with each other and then decided to get married.
Regards,
Victoriano Navarro

Primer grado would mean that the future spouses were not having relations with each other as there were not any dispensations that I know of for primer grado. Primer grado means siblings or father / daughter. For primer grado we are talking incest. Segundo grado are first cousins. If the person she was having sexual intercourse with is not named, then I would assume that it was a brother and not her father. Further research may clarify which family member was involved with her. Next, I would investigate if her brothers needed any dispensations when they married. Since it was 6 months penance, they assume that it was consensual and not rape?

I have seen dispensations for "primer con segundo grado" where an uncle is married to his niece. This was allowed with a dispensation.
R A Ricci

familias_bajio

9 years 9 months ago

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The relationship may have been with a brother of the groom or a brother of the groom's previous wife.

You are correct,, primer grado in this situation could be the brother of the groom or brother of the previous wife. but I think this is a only a small possibility since no one is named. In similar cases that I have seen, all parties that are involved are named. Sometimes they even state how long the affair is supposed to have been.

familias_bajio

9 years 9 months ago

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The marriage dispensation is listed on Claudia's "Guadalajara Dispensas" website (http://www.guadalajaradispensas.com/). And the link for the dispensa is at:

"México, Jalisco, registros parroquiales, 1590-1979," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18424-14807-0?cc=1874591 : accessed 19 October 2015), Guadalajara > Diócesis de Guadalajara > Matrimonios 1799, parte 1 > image 60 of 845; parroquias Católicas, Jalisco (Catholic Church parishes, Jalisco).

On image 62 the groom testified "...esta ligado con su pretensa con el vinculo del parentesco por afinidad de copula ilicita en primer grado por haberse mezclado con Maria Gertrudis Delgado, ya difunta, hermana de su dicha pretensa..." He then goes on to state that he also had relations with Marcela Delgado. So the impediment of primer grado was for the illicit relationship between Serapio and Maria Gertrudis, Maria Marcela's sister. Maria Marcela's penance was probably for her illicit relationship with Serapio.

Best regards,
Austin

Thank you to everyone for your help. I went over the image again and it had that the information of the primer grado was stated on 10th of September of the present year 1799 in the IM. I looked for it but was not successful as the IM's are not in order actually they are in reverse order and then mixed up, but 10th of September was not in it. So thanks again to everyone!!!

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